Legislature(1993 - 1994)
02/26/1993 09:15 AM Senate FIN
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
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= bill was previously heard/scheduled
MINUTES
SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE
February 26, 1993
9:15 a.m.
TAPES
SFC-93, #33, Side 1 (000-363)
CALL TO ORDER
Senator Drue Pearce, Co-chair, convened the meeting at
approximately 9:15 a.m.
PRESENT
All members (Co-chairs Pearce and Frank, and Senators Jacko,
Kelly, Kerttula, Rieger, and Sharp) were present.
ALSO ATTENDING: Senator Halford; Marcia McKenzie, American
Association of University Women; Judith Cavanaugh, Juneau
Coalition for Pro-choice; Caren Robinson, League of Women
Voters; Sherrie Goll, Alaska Women's Lobby; Jen Tucci;
William Burk; and aides to committee members and other
members of the legislature.
SUMMARY INFORMATION
SB 53 - Act annulling changes made by certain
regulations adopted by the Department of Health
and Social Services relating to
funding of abortion services under
the general relief medical program;
and providing for an effective
date.
CSSB 53 (Fin) (New Title, see p. 6 of these
minutes.) was REPORTED OUT of committee with
a
"do pass" recommendation and the following
fiscal notes:
DH&SS, AFDC (297.3)
DH&SS, Medicaid Facilities (454.0)
DH&SS, Medical Non-Facility (694.4)
DH&SS, General Relief Medical 288.7
DH&SS, Claims Processing ( 74.2)
SB 54 - Act relating to violations of laws by
juveniles; and providing for an effective
date.
CSSB 54 (Fin) (New Title, see p. 2 of these
minutes.) was REPORTED OUT of committee with
a "do pass" recommendation and the following
fiscal notes:
SFC/DOA, Public, Advocacy 22.5
SFC/DOA, Public, Defender 6.0
SFC/Courts 24.5
DOLaw -0-
DPS -0-
DOCorrections 10.8
SENATE BILL NO. 54
An Act relating to violations of laws by juveniles; and
providing for an effective date.
Co-chair Drue Pearce directed that SB 54 be brought on for
discussion and noted that the committee adopted a draft
committee substitute (8-LS0384\Q, 2/24/93, Chenoweth) at a
previous meeting. She further directed attention to new
fiscal notes for the Office of Public Advocacy, Public
Defender, and Alaska Court System.
Co-chairman Steve Frank asked that committee attention
revert to an amendment offered by Senator Rieger at a
previous hearing on the bill. The Co-chair explained that
he had since changed his opinion regarding the
appropriateness of the amendment and would
offer it for committee consideration. He then MOVED for
unanimous approval. Co-chair Pearce clarified that the
proposed amendment would remove Sec. 9 from a previously
adopted amendment by Co-chair Frank. She then called for
objections to the motion. No objection having been raised,
Senator Rieger's amendment was ADOPTED.
Senator Kelly MOVED that CSSB 54 (Finance) pass from
committee with individual recommendations. No objection
having been raised, CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 54(FIN) (An Act
relating to violations of laws by juveniles, to the remedies
for offenses and activities committed by juveniles and to
records of those offenses, and to incarceration of juveniles
who have been charged, prosecuted, or convicted as adults;
and providing for an effective date) was REPORTED OUT of
committee with the following fiscal notes:
SFC/DOA, Public, Advocacy 22.5
SFC/DOA, Public, Defender 6.0
SFC/Courts 24.5
DOLaw -0-
DPS -0-
DOCorrections 10.8
All members signed the committee report with a "do pass"
recommendation, with the exception of Senator Kerttula who
signed "no rec."
SENATE BILL NO. 53
An Act annulling changes made by certain regulations
adopted by the Department of Health and Social Services
relating to funding of abortion services under the
general relief medical program; and providing for an
effective date.
Co-chair Pearce directed that SB 53 be brought on for
discussion and referred to a draft committee substitute (8-
LS0343\J, Lauterback, 2/23/93). Senator Rieger MOVED for
adoption of the draft as a Senate Finance Committee
Substitute. Senator Kelly OBJECTED. Senator Kerttula
called for the question. Co-chair Pearce directed that a
roll call vote be taken.
YEA: Rieger, Kerttula, Jacko, Frank, Pearce
NAY: Kelly Sharp
The motion carried on a vote of 5 to 2, and CSSB 53
(Finance) was ADOPTED.
Senator Rieger explained that the major difference between
CSSB 53 (Finance) and the original bill is language that
places in statutes the situation prior to adoption of the
regulations. It precludes re-adoption of the same
regulations at a later time. The original bill merely
repealed the regulations, while the committee substitute
sets repeal of the regulations in statutes.
Speaking to the fiscal notes accompanying the bill, Senator
Rieger explained that positive fiscal impact was associated
with promulgation of the regulations. Repeal of the
regulations, in effect, undoes that positive impact. The
fiscal notes accompanying SB 53 are thus negative. Senator
Rieger acknowledged that the positive impact of promulgation
and the negative impact of repeal do not exactly match. He
advised that he had not had an opportunity to reconcile the
difference. The end result, however, is a net negative
fiscal note.
Senator Sharp directed attention to the following language
set forth within Sec. 2 of CSSB 53 (Finance):
The department shall pay for abortion procedures
under this chapter to the extent permitted under
federal law.
He then referenced the following subsection and advised that
it appears to cover abortion procedures not covered under
federal law from state general funds. Senator Rieger
concurred. Senator Sharp commented that CSSB 53 (Finance)
does more than simply void the regulations promulgated by
the administration. Senator Rieger explained that abortions
were paid for under Medicaid until precluded by federal
regulations. For a number of years, the state first looked
to Medicaid reimbursement. Since that is not now available,
coverage is provided under the general relief medical
program. The statutes were never changed to reflect the
fact that federal Medicaid regulations had changed. The
above-noted subsections reflect the practice prior to
adoption of the regulations.
Senator Sharp asked if the proposed bill would expand
eligibility beyond the economic threshold offered under
Medicare. Senator Rieger responded, "I don't think so. It
never came up, and I don't see how it could." Eligibility
for Medicaid and eligibility for general relief medical are
both described elsewhere in statutes.
WILLIAM BURK next came before committee to speak to the
bill. He urged passage of SB 53, saying it would be cheaper
for the state to fund abortions than it would be to keep
children on welfare rolls and public assistance. Mr. Burk
said he had worked as a social worker and had seen the
results of unwanted children. By the time they are two
years old, nine out of ten are on the AFDC rolls. The state
then has to pay foster parents, welfare, Medicaid, etc.
Mr. Burk noted that the United States was founded on
separation of church and state. He then voiced his belief
that the regulations were adopted at the urging of "right-
wing, conservative, christian fundamentalists." Mr. Burk
voiced his belief that a woman should have a choice, and he
suggested that abortions would be performed whether or not
they are funded by the state. The rich have always had an
opportunity for an abortion. Poor women are the ones who
have suffered.
MARCIA McKENZIE, American Association of University Women,
next came before committee. She voiced support for a
woman's right to self-determination and reproductive rights.
She further voiced support for CSSB 53 (Finance) and urged
passage.
Ms. McKenzie acknowledged that abortion services in Alaska
are costly. When travel is included, the cost can become
prohibitive. Alaska's rate of teen pregnancy remains among
the highest in the nation. A young person having an
unwanted child often faces poverty and bitterness caused by
"removal of opportunity" for a better life. Approximately
20,000 children (5% of Alaska's population) are currently
being raised by single parents supported by public funding.
The cost far outstrips the cost of terminating unwanted
pregnancies.
Ms. McKenzie further attested to the psychological burden of
an unwanted pregnancy on both the mother and the child.
Further, the legislation will remove the unwarranted
intrusion of government into the most private aspects of
health care for women who cannot afford medical care on
their own. The regulations stipulate that abortion would be
covered by general relief medical in cases of rape, incest,
or when a mother's life is in danger. Ms. McKenzie stressed
the traumatic impact of rape and incest, and advised that
often a woman does not wish to reveal how she became
pregnant. It would be extremely difficult for women who
would be required to document the cause of their pregnancy
under strict enforcement of the proposed regulations.
Ms. McKenzie stressed that, under the separation of church
and state, the termination of a pregnancy is an individual
judgment that must be left to the woman. The proposed
regulations would impose that decision and a particular
moral code only on those who do not have the financial
resources to deal with the situation on their own. In her
concluding remarks, Ms. McKenzie posed the question: Is it
fair that these women are deprived of control of their lives
simply because of their financial situation?
JEN TUCCI next came before committee. She urged passage of
the legislation, saying that she supports a woman's right to
choose. Ms. Tucci advised that the bill also relates to the
basic right to privacy as well as discrimination against
poor women. The decision of whether or not to have a child
should not be based on whether or not an individual can pay
for an abortion.
JUDITH CAVANAUGH, Juneau Coalition for Pro-choice, next came
before committee. She explained that the coalition consists
of more than 400 individuals in the Juneau area. Through
use of a mail survey and phone bank, the coalition compiled
a data base of 3,800 registered, pro-choice, women
supporters. Mr. Cavanaugh voiced support for CSSB 53
(Finance), advising that the bill will protect the
constitutional right to privacy for all women by protecting
the right to choose, regardless of income level. The
coalition opposed the regulations when they were first
introduced, and it was successful in getting more than 700
people in Juneau to voice their opposition to the
regulations during the comment period. Opposition to the
regulations focuses upon:
1. Alaska's Constitution which includes a broad
right to privacy clause that protects a woman's right to
choose, regardless of whether she is rich or poor.
2. The fact that the strictest abortion laws in the
world do not stop abortions.
At issue is whether low income women and teenagers in Alaska
will have access to safe abortion services or must seek
desperate help elsewhere. The regulations place an undue
burden on "poor women in rural and Southeast Alaska where
abortion services are not available at this time." The
regulations will force these women to seek unsafe abortions
or to bear children they do not want and cannot support.
The potential social costs of the regulations are enormous.
Unwanted children in Alaska often become wards of the state
at great cost to all. Mr. Cavanaugh urged support for the
bill.
CAREN ROBINSON, League of Women Voters, next came before
committee. She voiced support for CSSB 53 (Finance) on
behalf of the League's 400 members and urged passage.
SHERRIE GOLL, Alaska Women's Lobby, next came before
committee, voicing support for CSSB 53 (Finance) and urging
that it move forward. She noted that should the bill pass
and withstand the Governor's veto, it would provide an
additional savings in the form of legal costs that would not
have to be expended to defend the constitutionality of the
regulations.
Senator Kerttula MOVED for passage of CSSB 53 (Finance) with
individual recommendations. Senator Sharp OBJECTED. He
then noted that testimony pointed out that there are now
approximately 20,000 dependent children. This situation
occurred while abortion was an available option. It is thus
questionable whether the proposed bill will have a
meaningful effect. The Senator further advised that he
resented the implication that religion is involved. The
bill contains no reference thereto. Senator Kelly also
voiced OBJECTION, stating, "I really object to the committee
substitute." He said it goes far beyond "anything that's
been discussed." He suggested that a good word for it would
be "greedy," and he further suggested that it makes certain
there will be enough votes to sustain the Governor's veto.
Senator Rieger acknowledged comments by Senator Sharp that
the primary focus of repeal of the regulations relates to
the right to choose rather than the fiscal effect, the
impact on the number of dependent children, or religious
considerations. He said his support for the bill stems from
the "desirability of having a woman's right to choose
protected."
Senator Sharp explained that he supported the original
version of the bill, when it was before Senate Health &
Social Services Committee. He then voiced continued support
for that version, saying that CSSB 53 (Finance) appears to
set the legislation up for negative reaction from the
administration. That may negate total legislative efforts.
Co-chair Pearce directed that a roll call vote be taken on
the MOTION for passage of CSSB 53 (Finance):
YEA: Jacko, Kerttula, Rieger, Frank, Pearce
NAY: Kelly, Sharp
The motion CARRIED on a vote of 5 to 2, and CS FOR SENATE
BILL NO. 53(FIN) (An Act relating to payment for abortions
under Medicaid and general relief medical assistance;
annulling changes made by certain regulations adopted by the
Department of Health and Social Services relating to funding
of abortion services under the general relief medical
program; and providing for an effective date) was REPORTED
OUT of committee with the following fiscal notes:
DH&SS, AFDC (297.3)
DH&SS, Medicaid Facilities (454.0)
DH&SS, Medical Non-Facility (694.4)
DH&SS, General Relief Medical 288.7
DH&SS, Claims Processing ( 74.2)
Co-chair Frank and Senators Jacko, Rieger, and Kerttula
signed the committee report with a "do pass" recommendation.
Co-chair Pearce signed "do pass w/out amendment." Senators
Kelly and Sharp signed "do not pass."
ANNOUNCEMENTS
Co-chair Pearce announced that the following legislation
would be heard March 1, 1993, at 9:00 a.m.:
SB 19 CRIME OF CONSPIRACY
SB 46 AUTHORIZE MOOSE FARMING
SB 49 YEAR-END CAMPAIGN FINANCE REPORTS
ADJOURNMENT
There being nothing further to come before committee at this
time, the meeting was adjourned at approximately 9:45 a.m.
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